Modern speakers v Vintage designs

[SAK24]

I have had more pairs of speakers over the years than I would like to admit ! From home made speakers with 12" cones to electrostatic hybrids and a lot in between. One i recall was the Wharfedale Harewood, which was so expensive to make it got discontinued quickly. I loved them but far too big for the room and had a built in crossover in the plinth. Over the years I had speakers from Tannoy, Spendor, Celestion, Harbeth, Quad, Epos, Mordaunt Short, Martin Logan, Focal, Dynaudio, and some active speakers too. I was a big Harbeth fan for many years. Very smooth and detailed, true 'monitors'. Expensive though. On demos I could not get on with B&W speakers in the lower or mid-end of their range, and many designs by manufacturers are made to impress at first listening but become really fatiguing over time. The little bookshelf Spendors I had, bought in a sale, were fabulous, but sold them for more than I paid for them a year or so back, as they did not really have the dynamics of some others.

With several audio systems I find I get almost as much listening pleasure from some older designs than newer ones.

The old Dynaudio bookshelf speakers in my garden workshop are truly amazing for their size. The active Focal SBe's work superbly with keyboard synthesisers as well as Hi Fi audio from vinyl, CD. streaming etc. They were chosen at a professional retailer for studios, going back and forth with different models. The active Dynaudios were the closest to the Focal's but kept coming back to the Focals for their clarity and detail, and realism. They put a lot of Hi Fi audio speakers to shame.

The Quad Revela 1 is a modern speaker with Ribbon tweeter. Amazing quality for the price. Could easily sell for three times their price if they had been made by an Italian speaker firm, that good ! Martin Logan electrostatics are superb but not for everyone as they will expose your source and expose all the weaknesses in a recording or transmission. I cannot play some of my older CD's through them as some of the engineers clearly did not know how to record digital sound, and they can sound really unpleasant. But on a good recording it's like being in the audience, or the studio. You don't have to spend a fortune to get good audio speakers. Balance of the system is more important than anything else. I made mistakes over the years but am comfortable with what I ended up with. Other views please ?

[Mechanic]

All my speakers over the years have been pro audio, the Tannoys in the office are the 12" Superdual and I much prefer them to any hifi speakers that i've heard over the years.  Main system in the living room is 4 way fully horn loaded, home built but based on a mix of Funktion One/Turbosound cabinet designs and using their drivers. Kitchen it 8" Tannoys.

I've listened to modern expensive hifi speakers in demo rooms and never been impressed. 

I've built several passive crossovers all using high quality capacitors and hand wound air cored inductors but I think the crossovers in most hifi systems are poor quality from cabinets i've had apart.

[wenig watt]

I have built around 30 to 40 different speakers over the years. Mostly building suggestions from people who develop speakers professionally. I have also built some for friends and relatives. Horn systems and open baffles with full range drivers have survived. I rarely like multi-way systems (more than 2). I consider crossover frequencies between 1000 and 3000 Hz to be ‘problematic’. The naturalness of the reproduction usually seems damaged to me. This is probably due to the multiple transients in a range to which my hearing is sensitive.
I've been to the High End every year since 2015. That I have only heard impressive loudspeakers there relatively rarely... It's probably due to the show situation, which overwhelms many dealers.
One of the most impressive demonstrations was a very large classic Tannoy...
With regard to the crossover components, I can only say that the quality of the finished loudspeakers is usually very poor. However, a well-designed crossover is always superior to a poor one with expensive components.
I also consider expertise in room acoustics to be extremely important, as loudspeakers always interact with the room. I have been using a Phonic handheld measuring system for many years to easily determine the frequency response at various points in the room. This helps enormously with the setup.

 Best regards

Arndt

[MarcelNL]

I have built around 30 to 40 different speakers over the years. Mostly building suggestions from people who develop speakers professionally. I have also built some for friends and relatives. Horn systems and open baffles with full range drivers have survived. I rarely like multi-way systems (more than 2). I consider crossover frequencies between 1000 and 3000 Hz to be ‘problematic’. The naturalness of the reproduction usually seems damaged to me. This is probably due to the multiple transients in a range to which my hearing is sensitive.
I've been to the High End every year since 2015. That I have only heard impressive loudspeakers there relatively rarely... It's probably due to the show situation, which overwhelms many dealers.
One of the most impressive demonstrations was a very large classic Tannoy...
With regard to the crossover components, I can only say that the quality of the finished loudspeakers is usually very poor. However, a well-designed crossover is always superior to a poor one with expensive components.
I also consider expertise in room acoustics to be extremely important, as loudspeakers always interact with the room. I have been using a Phonic handheld measuring system for many years to easily determine the frequency response at various points in the room. This helps enormously with the setup.

 Best regards

Arndt

I completely agree, horns (and in my case front loaded horns) and open baffles or a combination of the two perform best IMHO. High efficiency and large surface area (cones, baffles, horn flares) matter and keep cone travel (and hence distortion) low.

Crossovers? Best avoided alltogether when possible, getting a two way crossover to sound great is complex enough, that complexity increases exponentially with every frequency range added.
We learned one golden rule, 'the crossover parts you calculated are never the values that are best' (YMMV)

 

[Mechanic]

I have built around 30 to 40 different speakers over the years. Mostly building suggestions from people who develop speakers professionally. I have also built some for friends and relatives. Horn systems and open baffles with full range drivers have survived. I rarely like multi-way systems (more than 2). I consider crossover frequencies between 1000 and 3000 Hz to be ‘problematic’. The naturalness of the reproduction usually seems damaged to me. This is probably due to the multiple transients in a range to which my hearing is sensitive.
I've been to the High End every year since 2015. That I have only heard impressive loudspeakers there relatively rarely... It's probably due to the show situation, which overwhelms many dealers.
One of the most impressive demonstrations was a very large classic Tannoy...
With regard to the crossover components, I can only say that the quality of the finished loudspeakers is usually very poor. However, a well-designed crossover is always superior to a poor one with expensive components.
I also consider expertise in room acoustics to be extremely important, as loudspeakers always interact with the room. I have been using a Phonic handheld measuring system for many years to easily determine the frequency response at various points in the room. This helps enormously with the setup.

 Best regards

Arndt

Regarding crossover frequencies the Tannoy Superdual cross at 1.8khz between the 12" and 2" (120hz from subs to the 12")

Front horn living room system crossover points are:
15" 30 to 114 hz
10" low mid 114 to 455 hz
8" mid 455 to 5777 hz (the 8" also has a phase plug the full depth of the horn)
1" HF 5777 hz to way above my hearing